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Created: 10/04/2010 Reporters Roundtable The movie about the founding of Facebook has been nearly universally admired, yet youre hard-pressed, when watching it, to actually like any of the characters. Is this the way Facebook actually is? Guests Caroline McCarthy (CNET) and Alexia Tsotsis (TechCrunch) discuss.

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Ep. 666: Where weEp 50 The Social Network_ The stoner channel mark the sign of the beast

-- and dont. Hi everyone welcome to reporters roundtable our podcast on a single tech topical week. And this week that topic is the social network the movie. About the founding of FaceBook. Against the -- this movie is the union nearly universally admired got a nine -- an approval rating on the tomato meter rotten tomatoes. But is -- accurate not just the cts but spirit and the ethics of the ethos of entrepreneurship in general and FaceBook in particular. This -- related topics -- what were going to be discussing today -- two great guests to get into with. First from CNET news in our social in our New York office Caroline McCarthy. Author of our blog about social networking called social Caroline wrote a great review of this movie called social network weaves a complex web Carolyn thanks for joining us. Thank you very much and from techcrunch. In San Francisco -- -- Who if I pronounced that right. -- Also covers FaceBook for that site. And wrote a another great review called the social network and the rise of the terror nerd I just love that title -- thank you so much for a time -- -- so lets get into this we -- about thirty minutes first of all. I think experts say you guys are both part of this. Of a younger generation and I the FaceBook generation what did we think about this movie as a movie and as a reflection of kind of the FaceBook culture. -- -- go to you first. -- So I think -- as. I as a representation of our our generation I know that summer views have sad. That this is like and and these are kind of -- I think exclusively hit three news outlets that were like. -- this is this is young people as told by old people but looking at it and looking at how. Over the course of the movie especially after FaceBook is -- and how -- how the characters eight major characters my connectors background extras whenever how to interact essentially get. I thought was was actually pretty. Spot on and and that the assessment of like this is a world where for the first time we all. All are almost all of us have a public persona. And that its put out there for for either for interpretation -- from -- interpretation. An and I think that that is is really bolster by the ct you out by. What you have multiple sort of -- you up multiple court scenes in the movies from different trials different retelling this. Different characters in a different things happened and then -- it all you have this narrative of the founding of FaceBook and its like. Well you know how accurate isnt how accurate does -- have to be because this is. This is this is like a voyeuristic retelling on almost. -- period is from David interest -- -- them. So I think that thats thats really -- -- edited didnt speak him. Well I think I think Caroline and kind of Madonna and her new that this is based in this is basically -- creation. Right this is based integration this is the closest weve got the mythology. And not in our generation because. Its very -- to aid to create like. It longhorn -- birds are symbolic narrated with the quick -- of information that if you are in general Y. Wednesday it would electing -- -- higher than the older partisan yeah were definitely deal arent. Yeah our brain our brains dont function in kind of a law or paying -- -- -- -- and -- that. But so if youre gonna have if youre gonna have any kind. Unifying story it better be about the platform that. Has created this situation of late king of an update then it and short -- lake. Yes -- -- are -- stories are told in space that that is so. Having them. I think its that they attempt by -- insurance -- -- like an older generation to kind of interpret what our status updates generation. Is doing lets -- big banner. Ads that are. Chance. At defining -- there. The -- -- definite idea of the new world what you know its interesting that some people are calling this a creation myth and even in at the end of the movie. By the way for those youre watching this show spoiler alert just. Go see the film if you havent. Were not going over the plot in great detail in this but we are going to be talking about this film there will be spoilers. Be -- so eight eaten even at the end of the movie they talk about every creation myth needs a double or bill and I forgot what they said. And this really is I I think in many ways a creation because it is a new world that we -- living in now before FaceBook and social networking which there were social networks and. And update right -- an early -- -- in rarely seen Zuckerberg is using live journal yes I think thats thats kind of an interesting throwback to the the the pre creations -- but. There is the -- before. Where it was where we -- our lives. -- in -- the physical world to an extent and there at the world now where so much of our our of our. Our interaction is. Computer mediated. Even more so than once before and FaceBook -- it was that creation so. The thing in the movie is says that at. Every every creation that needs a villain. In this movie we have a lot of villains but I find this movie during thing because there seemed to be no sympathetic character now what -- you think about that were there any. -- -- we rooting for in this movie and why does this movie work when it appears to me that theres nobody they were actually. Wed like. Well this is interesting I thought because on. When I read the script I read the script about a year before the move became an have to Ill have to look back at the script maintained to see exactly anything changed -- by one thing that struck me when I side the movie. Was that Eduardo Severin was a much more sympathetic character than I had thought he -- like and I wonder if that was just like. The lines that seems sort of you know its and Arlene vindictive in my way or the highway that the -- written now cing a lot more forceful than when they were spoken by you know like wide eyed puppy ce adorable -- -- Garfield. So I I dont know -- that was just a matter after they -- or if they specifically. Made an effort to make him more sympathetic because in in the script that I read he came across as sort of and any does come across as -- in the movie but it in a much more sort of tragic hero sends them you know Im obsessed -- -- the old order and with being part of that tragic perhaps but I wouldnt say that he does anything necessarily -- in the film. -- now he doesnt now. Oh yeah when he called -- -- parker when everybody likes standing next to you because it makes me -- grave right. Yeah and that and mostly I -- -- the most pivotal heroic moment and yet I I do think that I read the script also going entering came -- -- the way more whiny and. Yet he came across as -- really -- in in. Them so. Is this the way that the gen Y socially connect the world works where basically everybodys a jerk or are -- are people. How do you become likable when -- building something the state. You dont like you to go likable after you build it I mean this is this is a lot give belly and story here its like. You do whatever it its -- Silicon Valley. -- and sometimes you do whatever its okay. Might marking -- within that is is that Id tried every -- featured in the back. -- -- -- -- the ability of products and then. Once a bunch of people like it and you dont care about the people -- -- think -- jerk I mean this is every huge calendar are almost every successful hundred. Now one of the things about this film it that I that did not resonate. With me was -- trying to figure out as I was watching the social network what drives -- drove. Mark Zuckerberg to build this out and in the movie. It seems like he is just desperate for -- recognition in. The established social order and trying to be part of the final clubs. Is that what drives him -- -- -- is a difference between what will we know of Zuckerberg what really drives them and what. Apparently tried some in the movie is -- revenge is that money is it to create something it is it. To get -- I mean what is driving Zuckerberg in the real world to make this thing. I think it means it did that that is one of the things that is -- was the most sort of unfortunately inaccurate things about the movie -- -- -- it was very well done but its simply isnt true that in a big getting into the final clubs and being part of the of the order I I do not think -- Remotely close to what Mark Zuckerberg was thinking and I think hes one of those people who has those mines where hes just like. He he sees ways in which things can be connect it. And and he wants to be the person who makes -- connections he sort of wants to be like. I like a latter day wizard -- you know what I mean Im things happen where they could happen but they dont happen and I think that. And this was some. It did the -- that motivation is a difficult to play on screen. And be. It -- it also you adapt to bring in a whole lot more back story about the ct that. There were hurt students on every campus in the northeast and and probably the rest of the country but I I was in school and -- -- at the time. Building these online Facebooks because their schools were all doing it in their schools what were all for the most part doing terrible job of baton and so this sort of been. Someone like Mark Zuckerberg would have had like. Probably. Two to three years exposure. -- of these sorts of the student directories going on line. I mean Friendster -- around live journal have been around. I so I think it was a matter of him seeing where nothing had gotten it right before and him believing that he could be the ones do -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Iranian manifest destiny of product vision I mean theres a quoted the on the -- A guy who makes any -- doesnt owe money to everyone has ever built in chair and play keys he thought I could make it -- there. The way I can have to do it like being socially accepted I dont think I dont think mature product visionaries really care about being socially accepted. -- may -- in deep down inside but you get it gets the point where you just you -- execute your vision. Lets see something happen. How much of the Harvard. East Coast Ivy League school ethos is part of creating something like FaceBook how much of that gets in your brain and is is in the the creation story -- there. Well see thats something I could see coming into play and I can see market having comes -- that connection Merom in it in -- the way it that way that its portrayed the movie is kind of a kind of an over the top -- -- but yes Harvard is a very exclusive school. The social networks that were out there were not something that any Harvard student would want to be part of because they were big and they were open and they were full weirdos using ke names then and so I think anyone would with a little bit of sort of traditional. Old school. So soul. Its sort of with social class consciousness. Would it be would be turned off by what was out there where that would you know dead they kind of like. Net cam girl shops and glitter profiles and and all that I absolutely think -- and so I think thats certainly did come into play. But I think it would have been more so marks awareness of then his desire to be part. Im asking more about the the ethos in a school like Harvard of build your own future which is part you know and hinted at in the movie. -- this. Did did students like Zuckerberg go to Harvard because they have a vision of creating their own destiny -- Harvard put that in their brains. Well the thing is is that I had I -- you may have been a little different Harvard which -- always been a little more entrepreneurial but I I was I was out another. Small northeast college -- the time we sent I think 40% of our graduating class to Wall Street. -- hello -- and there is -- buried there with a whole. A whole lot of fun it was much more like chase the dollar sign then following year like create your future and I think Harvard was was -- -- earn a place. I mean this is what the movie at what I think the movie is actually an accurate about that. Its in portrait -- does this -- with Blake. Top top class people and -- go to any I dont really know from experience but. A little winkle Abbas twins are our likes it its called it looked like a golden god hand six I didnt think I mean their -- person but they arent adapting -- meaning he added that start. Out but it would like -- characters starts the movie. Thank coming like how do you distinguish yourself in a population of individuals and all at dollar SATs -- I mean its not I dont think bit. Hot -- -- me that -- got like nerd -- -- -- -- Ill put people here. And I dont think it that was actually everyone workers -- Im sure there -- -- yeah there -- That in other Mark Zuckerberg. Working on I agree or youll end here theres seven other -- that the -- is working on similar projects like connect you -- harbor connector whatever was he was just the one when. -- the most streamlining its. User friendly version thats why -- -- He cracked the code which language French have a question of of -- my question of whatever happened to know one of my vorite parts in movies when. Larry Summers who former I think Treasury Secretary and Im president Harvard. In it in the movie anyway is talking to the legal office who managed to get an audience with them in their complaining that Zuckerberg has stolen their idea and Summers says but it. Im paraphrasing here. -- freak and who somebody stole your idea this is Harvard yet another idea get out of my office. I can kinda see that happening at Harvard with a good life lesson but what happened to the -- losses since then without getting back there world -- wanna -- Since. Since FaceBook and and since the movie well what are they up to. Why doesnt I guess so yeah I -- -- I saw a camera camera in Tylers not affiliated -- -- camera and is that the publisher of this New York nightlife site. Actually has been getting a lot of good press and -- I dont know what actually makes money but I know that we eat and its a close friend of his who is the editor in chief of the site so I think the idea that -- together and hes pretty hands off there but they just done. They went -- -- 2008 Olympics in Beijing on preteens and anything is the anonymity placed sixth in care. Which is better than most people thought they would do because appears typically not not -- spent much the us a strong. But then. -- then went to Oxford to get -- -- and there. What do you video youve got a 65 million dollar settlement burning now burning on your back on and now youre gonna say I I created a guy. Heres a speculation. About the -- -- tons. I believe that they will found some kind of venture together because obviously theyre there in the spotlight now and theres probably. You know that like if it -- come up with something theyll probably get -- the backing and -- exposure so youre saying and in addition. To the money that they now have from their settlement. They also have the media spotlight on them because of the movie so its actually done immigrate vor they could they could go further and -- start up because people are watching and they have name recognition -- didnt really publicly before. I think so and actually Vanity Fair had a blog post that I made me laugh that was so so when do we get the inevitable -- Abbas reality show -- today. I dont and I do not think they would -- got I mean Ive Ive met the guys a couple of times I know I know some people who know -- -- and I do not think they would Hillary out and lets say your bets they. Well I mean. I other. -- week about the things that arent theyre not even in Christ and I think that theyre gonna being theyre not even in crunch -- yeah I did it. I I mean the current -- Ill open up. -- I I dont know if theyd be welcome back -- -- now. And that -- -- today. We we -- scinated. Reward people in the news. Took a risk and it doesnt seem like they took a risk I think I think it. Anyone is not in the in. Social network in. Legal -- dozens Zuckerberg because it just seems like -- chasing an idea that link that says it you. Wouldnt it if you invented -- that annually in anticipates that it seems like there. Right I thought I was a very resonant line and -- -- worst -- in. Was bounced out of FaceBook in financially and emotionally many ways what with with -- -- him since then -- got -- Huge settlement like use suited to the extent that some people say that. Considering he -- mean he wouldnt move cross country to help build based but he had some of arguably bad ideas for the company some people say that he he got the best deal out of anybody. I know -- key. He -- and an investment in seed round of of at least one -- start -- that I that I was miliar with a couple of years ago but I think and -- pretty low and -- because of the I noted I I I interviewed and metrics the author of the accidental bill leaner but thats -- based on innovating in last year and and and -- -- -- That Eduardo had been his source on the on the -- Intel. Basically. He completely. Cut off communication because of -- of lawyer pressure and and the terms of the settlement that -- -- that was -- on ult with ce. Now. Theres also one other major character in our world the world of lets start with the Sean Parker that but nothing from Napster. He I actually I interviewed him once -- he he was the -- that for -- arent. Yeah I -- yeah and youth seemed like your average arrogance start up item so. But whats happened to him has this movie affect what hes been up to this -- hes been -- he stayed active. We are profound Vanity Fair mean like last month. I think like I mean he he co founded causes with geo green button which has been one of the biggest apps on Facebooks platform -- in terms of -- reality. I would not necessarily say its been one in the most successful all. On in terms of achieving its goals but it certainly is extremely prominent system of apps. I believe hes she still collects these he -- founders fund in some capacity. Yes -- India according AM -- that founders binding heat that cause they in an adviser to the on and on the board of directors -- yeah amber. Yeah not is -- -- suspend him. So area on the bonds a bunch of base. I think you still you still involved in a bunch of styles also. Now there was one venture capitalists. While they had several who -- whose names they use the movie there was one venture capitalist who is intentionally left out are written now. Of the -- -- the book yet talk about that what happened there so who who was it again and and what happened what did he do -- FaceBook in the real world and who did it in the movie. Well as Michael -- -- and sequoia ask him. Yeah. -- -- -- basically he was the one who there were in in the book that uses real name and -- -- -- -- -- case equity or whatever and but there -- that the book had a lot of speculation on behalf of Sean Parker about why. More -- since equated to force on out of Plaxo because theyve been -- -- in a lead investor. And I Sean was not even confirmed source on. On the but although lets ce it he he totally wise and very obvious by. I think it like that kind. That kind of like well this is what we heard from this guy uses this about this guy. I wonder if it it it that just post so many legal problems the transiting screen meant. That he couldnt as introducing them left to map so he was in the script. -- if you really all it really was written so yeah the script you so he was in so with at you as a last minute change. I think yeah probably has some connections in Hollywood thats my -- and -- guys. They exerted pressure and -- keep -- -- out of that. Fascinating so. Weve talked -- about things that were different in the real world and in in the -- we go on and on about. Differences. I -- -- people obviously wouldnt pick what license and movie like this but. Lets talk a bit about the emotional accuracy of this I mean do you feel that this movie about FaceBook and about -- Captures the essence of the founding of minutes or is it just that -- gross simplification of what happens when -- and that this got started. I mean what does that tell Katie Couric then it was -- I wish it was that our way we were just a bunch of people letting writing code paraphrasing and were just -- -- people writing code and it wasnt really -- glamorous. Mean -- a -- if you watch startups think were back on and it really is a bunch in the writing code and its its account. Not not that. Meaning wounded drinking game where they hired there in interns -- another glaring inaccuracy. Why we I mean any wouldnt need is. Break into whatever server theyre trying to break into -- Work at -- you just need to -- like a social product bad bit. The drinking and that kind of rowdy atmosphere. And why they just dont really frankly Im hey I know that hey its good theyre really -- play. But I dont think it it at that level I dont think there. Like theres scene where theyd written that we were the groupie net about it I personally dont think that ever happening in Zuckerberg how to study girl pregnant -- on him and she -- that when it. That is -- -- of one of the most interest thing ctual changes between the real world and the movie which is Zuckerberg they dont make much of of Zuckerberg. Emotional it is. His girlfriend or lack thereof in the movies its really not a key part of of the film but in the real world he has and had a girlfriend. And why Ive never I dont understand -- all and they spend more time with Eduardo relations and they do with it was not I was wondering why that the movie worked with him being. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- I I wonder if I. If when none. When message was that was writing them but couldnt I -- You know luck. Marks real girlfriend has a completely private citizen she makes no effort to jump in front of cameras are she she never does interviews none of that shes a civilian she is she is a complete civilian -- do not touch her. Etc. now maybe that was the deal I I I wonder if that kids like that would just be like. First of all that would make -- that would make measured -- -- like really bad for putting a real character and who has has literally. Never asked for attention. I mean she was a teacher and now shes in med school like shes not like. Hes not a -- ago. -- -- Lets talk about it. This -- story to have nerds chase after pretty girl that has to be you and then and want. Nerd has relationship with other -- -- relatively stable Internet yeah it does make for -- Hollywood. Now but but the other the other thing is that I think for for a time and he I noted. Mark dated a girl he hes currently dating for awhile on the app for a -- then they got back together. So I know that there was some period in their when he was not dating her but I. Predict I dont particularly care about his personal life on that level so I I dont know what that what the real situation wasnt I dont really think that it made for Hollywood material -- Unix in incensed. -- Carolina lets say you both cover entrepreneur or some startups a lot I have is in the past myself quite a lot what do you. Affect you think a movie like physical memorization of starting a company like this through with the with. The all the ups and the downs will have on up -- -- -- hours. Well they say I -- Department. That they -- -- like. -- of that Wall Street. With supposed to be built behind culture and -- Oliver Stone was just horrified when in ct it is made a lot of kids wanna Gandhi but fox wouldnt buy it is that. In an anti anti rabies I would. I would think that that would probably also need a case where youre youre gonna wanna have kids who never wouldve thought it lined found dot conflict going and money try to find dot com stay. The discrepancy there is that in in the eighties and and up until very recently. They it. It you you could you could kind of be and and Ive read and read liars poker which details thats. Very well you could be kind of a total block had and still make a ton of money on Wall Street. You cant do that if your founding -- company you can even do that if your employee number 200 at -- tech company. That would mean you cant do it right why not. It is our. Or you are smart to be creative then you know its its -- thing where like maybe you know there might be people trying to -- to this industry on mass but I think it. A lot of them. Bull will soon find that it that it doesnt it its not. Its not that easy whereas -- in the financial services industry for a while this is one of the reasons we have the market crash button two years ago was it. For a while it it was ridiculously. Easy to get into it and to be successful and it. And youre basically playing a decade now and. Well Im look at this causes more people to study engineering I mean one of the reasons that I -- and I think its simply was not cool when I was young. Like not aligning the things that -- -- -- English and and and theres a line and ended -- records and as you know like that. A million dollars of the -- you know its cool a billion dollars and I think. That kind of entrepreneurial. Ambition. Has now -- been given a major cultural menu like. A Hollywood movie with 23 million dollars in ticket sales last weekend and so its. Opened up the space for a lot of culture surrounding. The story in the the founder -- in the movie and the founder -- in general like I just I just and video. Mark Zuckerberg rap about. That the social network and the -- Im Ian bits of and pay. Now thats I now -- Thats something that mainstream in in the sense relates yeah theres -- real equivalency between. That on your work burner till mid an entrepreneurial drive and -- like the rap. Game for example so that encourages kids to being ambitious. In in the tax the year -- in the engineering space that would be one or or wave positive. Yeah definitely I think -- for engineering look y -- It definitely will have a positive ct. But I I think they would like you know the youre youre gonna get a lot of people sort of like well I -- be in dot com -- and then but now. Thats harder than it -- and most. Does that for those of you. Listening out there. Its harder than it looks and most businesses il I was I covered when I was writing about this in the first bubble like I did about 1000 columns. Interviewing. Dot com studios and profiling accompanies them. Since then I believe the 990. Of those businesses are now out of business. Well yeah. Which by loyalists dissident to be interviewed by means the other way of looking at it just saying that most of these businesses il and the -- -- really wanted to militant. What about the effect on the FaceBook staff palace this movie has -- been they have again and this movie third as -- galvanizing influence of any sort. -- a let down or what. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- It was they were in it -- it didnt really get it together. And the effect. -- -- -- -- No -- So what it. Or other concentrating on -- they werent locked down period. Sixty days are concentrating on rolling out down -- calendar information in groups. Again its one of those things that. They dont really care thats -- when culture as I didnt always feel locked down unless youre on vacation. No I mean if we had nothing else. Is that kind of a coincidental timing for lockdown. cause you know they just rolled out. Groups and downloads and they went into lockdown mode to roll that out but the story goes but theyre also. You know the blanket came down over. Over them right after the movie came out. Im just I just wanted to speculating that anyway. Whats next are we gonna see a global movie are there any good other tales out there that can be Hollywood -- -- in such an entertaining way. We will definitely it ballooning that is think that earns money it got option. Yes. And and I mean it in and the thing is is like also the author of the book is like that you know very. Barry established and with with very well connected which Google book is gonna adoption panel let us okay. So -- got option I dont now. I was joking with Tom crap that an -- dislike. They should make it a Stoner comedy because. Googles origins I dont even really think you could beat them that Hollywood rarity in less -- estimated to total parity. Kind of the -- parent of Andys treatment that like it if you if you just really played up like. You that the ct that they are right on Razor Scooters and that theyve got this this donors -- to cater to to cater to Grateful Dead and like you know Matthew McConaughey can play him. But then oh Im adding something to chat and this product dont make me sit through Steve Jobs movie right some channel bottom pilot based on that the diet Steve Jobs yet all the secret diary would tell me -- -- think theyre Steve Jobs are lit up heart of Silicon -- I havent read the price that it is hard it is hard to make coding exciting on film yeah it -- unique. But there are. -- had -- a couple of like I mean wasnt there like some dot com exactly killed his wife for something like -- something theyll legitimately stick scandalous. -- and and it like some some kind of like -- gone bad story. It editors I spent murders -- So clear. That there have enough. And -- not mention any names that dont wanna be associated -- connect murder with any name -- about to say. -- Thank you if you look at tech mean and you look at killed will be a lot of like Google. Google Buzz accounts winner and then well -- actual story about killing. Oh -- them. I listen on that listen I Carolina lets yet thank you very much for your time. For those you havent seen the movie. I think Id recommend -- its its dated it kind of its ding in in my. Pleasure centers compared to other movies in both a lot of explosions and stuff and there was interest being I dont know I would recommend people feat especially if youre into tech. Carolina lets give you thumbs up for you guys on the film. Yes and its Oscar winning it and theres a picture early learning how to predictions -- actions I dont think so. Okay. Here my predictions -- critic I predict it will not get a single acting nominees and -- -- I. It it will look at his actors or the actors just too young I believe it will get nominated for best picture because now theyre but theyre ten best picture nominees that Ive gotten. I believe well get nominated for -- actor. Best school our current resonance score with -- is definitely up there. And well get nominated for screenplay adaptation I believe the -- that will win will be in -- the united argue with you on that. Have a electronic ink -- tire barrier. -- its beautiful beautiful women -- -- How every every shot -- -- -- -- -- there I think that -- added some really excellent chance of winning sodas are fields. -- definitely I think if -- it nominated itll be Garfield but the thing is is like. The Oscars are so political and the cast is so young and you look at what other big name actors have been in -- lead and supporting roles this year like. I got. Youre youre -- Alec Holland expert George Clooney poke at things that I -- that that the younger the younger cast it it gives -- -- advance. -- right. Well on that thank you for those predictions thank you both -- lets you very much for the time. You can. Get the show notes for this on roundtable of reporters roundtable dot cnet.com you can send an email to me about the show or other that you would like see it roundtable at cnet.com. Follow me and Twitter Im Rafe are AFP Caroline you are. -- CA RO and Alexia. And LEX I had anorexic. Right on thanks so much and thanks Leo for producing with you guys -- next week by everyone thank you -- thank.

On todays show, CNET reporter and 404 BFF Caroline McCarthy directs us in a live read-through of the actual script for the upcoming Facebook movie and also joins us in talking about 4Chan, Comic-Con, and this weekends insane hailstorm.

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